Ayre QB-9 Twenty

[ctsooner]

Great post!  The one thing I like about AQ is when speaking with Garth about his designs, it's all about physics.  He said he can measure a lot of parameters that show what his cables and cords are doing (I doubt I put that properly, but hopefully you understand what I'm saying).  I too hate the ridiculous claims that are made, but hey, it was Noel Lee who was the first huge marketer in cables and he was known to make lot's of 'claims'.  Then when so many would make them out of their cellars, but cause the mark ups are so huge, it was bound to happen.  It's like the unregulated supplement industry.

[BKDad]

Uhhh, I refuse to name names here.

[ctsooner]

It’s just you and me here BK. I, all ears. Hahahaha. Lol

[BKDad]

Nah.  Although I am not bothered if people throw internet rocks at me, I still don't think it's fair for me to do so.  So, I won't.

I guess even bringing the subject up wasn't fair.  As I said, ravings of a madman.

Besides, wtf do I know anyway?  I'm just another guy with access to the internet.  This is why I point to real experts and what they wrote about a subject whenever I can.

Edited February 25, 2021 by BKDad

[ctsooner]

I was just joking around.  Love your posts.

[BKDad]

I get you...

Still, always consider the source!

[Joe Whip]

ESP is Essential Sound Products.  I have come to the conclusion that the audiophile cords I have been using over the years have been robbing the system of something and the ESP let’s it all in and then out, 

[Steve Edwards]

Joe, I'm considering upgrading the power cords on my SS mono amps.  What brand / model of cords did your ESP's replace?

[Huang]

On 2/22/2021 at 4:50 PM, ctsooner said:

I've got a GREAT Wireworld ethernet cable that I'm selling.  It's their series 7.  I may sell both that I have.  If I decide to sell the second one, I'll upgrade.  Been using both with a medical ethernet filter in the middle of them, but my new unit has a special filter built in, so I don't need the extra one.  Just ordered new cables and cords and will be listing a bunch of them on USAM.  can't wait to get my new loom.  I went crazy and even got a dragon power cord for the Niagara 3000.

Tell me more about this medical ethernet filter? When I re-piped my house I had the guy run ethernet to every room. Rocket scientist me put it on the wrong wall in one room, so I have a long run to my DAC.

[TomicTime]

Bob - congrats on the QB-9 Twenty........how is it sounding ??????
best

 

jim

[BKDad]

11 hours ago, Huang said:

Tell me more about this medical ethernet filter? When I re-piped my house I had the guy run ethernet to every room. Rocket scientist me put it on the wrong wall in one room, so I have a long run to my DAC.

This isn't an Ethernet filter, per se.  It will provide isolation for you and that is probably 94% of the solution.

https://www.tp-link.com/us/business-networking/accessory/mc100cm/

These are available on Amazon, Newegg, and CDW for stupid low prices.  TP-Link also has other models for Gig-E and as well as units that use SFP modules instead of a built-in interface.

You may also want to check this out: https://uptoneaudio.com/products/etherregen  This might get you the remaining 6%.  Or more.  (Or not!)

Full disclosure: I have experience with the TP-Link product, but not for audio applications.  It did what it said it would.  Other guys I know have used a pair successfully for their audio streaming use.  But, its cheap enough (like <$50 for a pair plus whatever length fiber cable you need) that I don't feel like a jerk suggesting it.  Given the price of fancy Ethernet cables, using fiber isn't a bad deal at all. The power supplies they provide are not audio system quality - that mostly matters at the DAC end.  A passable replacement is fairly cheap, though, too.  

Full disclosure 2: I have no experience with that EtherRegen gadget.  Zero.  That mostly is because I don't use streaming.  But, I do own and use an Uptone ISO Regen USB isolation product on our QB-9 Twenty.   It has its flaws, but it pretty much does what they say it does.  

And, as I always remind people, I am just a random guy you don't know who has internet access.  So, treat anything and everything I might suggest appropriately. 

[GdnrBob]

Quote

And, as I always remind people, I am just a random guy you don't know who has internet access.  So, treat anything and everything I might suggest appropriately. 

@BKDad,

I'll trust an honest person before an 'expert'. 

At least, when it concerns audio.

Bob

 

[BKDad]

1 hour ago, GdnrBob said:

@BKDad,

I'll trust an honest person before an 'expert'. 

At least, when it concerns audio.

Bob

 

OK, if you say so.

The TP-Link gadgets are cheap enough that for Huang's application, it probably wouldn't cost much more than a decent Ethernet cable.  Not a boutique cable, either.  So, if it doesn't work as well as he'd like, he won't hate me forever.  Maybe just nine years.

[GdnrBob]

@BKDad,

I should have asked-

How does it work?

Does it need to be powered?

B

[BKDad]

2 hours ago, GdnrBob said:

@BKDad,

I should have asked-

How does it work?

Does it need to be powered?

B

How does it work?  Ahh, that's a simple question with a long answer.  Actually. several of each.  Do you mean how does optical transmission work?  Why might it be better for audio use?  How does Ethernet work?  My fingers are getting numb at the mere prospect of answering all those.

If you have the patience and time, there must be 41 threads about this over at whatever ComputerAudiophile.com is called now.  A fellow using the online name of jabbr is pretty knowledgable on the subject.  Also, there's this:  https://andreweverard.com/2015/06/08/high-resolution-audio-now-with-added-fibre/

These TP-Link convertors each need a power supply.  One is supplied in the package for each converter, although it's not the most audiophiley solution.  I think the power supply quality is far more important for the downstream converter - the one closest to your streaming device or DAC.  One of the main reasons for using these gadgets is to electrically isolate the network side of the system from the audio side, so it's a bad idea to dirty up the side you want to be squeaky clean..

For the EtherRegen, there's an explanation on the Uptone web site.  As I said, I've never seen one of these in person, nor do I know anybody who uses one.  At least as far as I know.

Our digital audio solution here is pretty simple in concept.  We have a converted Asus Chromebox running Daphile.  This connects via a fancy cable to the ISORegen, which in turn plugs into the QB-9 Twenty.  That's it.  If I want to add more albums to the Daphile "server" I just send them via WiFi from the iMac I'm typing on, which is attached to a RAID drive with the music library.  The Daphile machine has a 1TB SSD, which is enough for a lot of music.  It rarely is more than 1/3 full.  Daphile will allow streaming and internet "radio" play, but I only tried listening to an internet radio stream once to see if it worked.  I'm not going to be much help with the streaming part, I'm afraid.  The system we have isn't quite like using vinyl, but it's closer to that in thinking than it is to listening to FM radio, which I think is kind of an analog to streaming. 

[ctsooner]

I've played with optical isolation a bit when it first started.  I met a few of the founders at ComputerAudiophile and they walked my novice and non engineering butt through the process.  We listened at first to the stock wall warts. Then we moved onto an inexpensive LPS and we went up from there.  We also noticed the biggest difference in putting two LPS's in teh system, but if you must, just one on the DAC side it's worth it.

[BKDad]

15 hours ago, GdnrBob said:

@BKDad,

I should have asked-

How does it work?

Does it need to be powered?

B

I haven't watched the whole video, but this might be of interest: 

 

No, I have no connection to Sonore, or Small Green Computer.  Never even saw any of their products in real life.  But, like most people here, I do have a connection to YouTube.  :8^)

[Huang]

On 2/26/2021 at 3:31 PM, BKDad said:

OK, if you say so.

The TP-Link gadgets are cheap enough that for Huang's application, it probably wouldn't cost much more than a decent Ethernet cable.  Not a boutique cable, either.  So, if it doesn't work as well as he'd like, he won't hate me forever.  Maybe just nine years.

I thank you for taking the time to respond. I will never hate you, it’s up to me to weight the information and make my own decision. 

[BKDad]

12 minutes ago, Huang said:

I thank you for taking the time to respond. I will never hate you, it’s up to me to weight the information and make my own decision. 

You never know.  People can get upset over all sorts of things.  

Anyway, I certainly wish you luck with your project!

[ctsooner]

BK, you ADD so much to this forum.  What I've come to enjoy about this board is that we all care about the music and are adult about things.  This isn't your normal online community where folks are often mean or selfish.  It's typical of what I've come to respect and enjoy aobut Vandersteen owners I've met over the years.  We all have strong opinions about things, but realize we all hear differently.  We also all appreciate all gear regardless of cost.  

Heck, it's probably more fun for most of us to help folks purchase an inexpensive system (around the Steen's of course) than we do an expensive one.  

[jkmcc]

I am with you Pete. It’s nice to have stumbled across a forum where I know I’m not going to  be yelled at for asking a question or making an observation. I realize I know only a little and I am basically stumbling around in the dark trying to sort out how best to optimize the sound of my system in my room. So I’m happy to have the help. Let’s face it, at the end of the day we’re really just talking about record players and glorified FM radios! 😊

best, John

[BKDad]

3 minutes ago, jkmcc said:

I am with you Pete. It’s nice to have stumbled across a forum where I know I’m not going to  be yelled at for asking a question or making an observation. I realize I know only a little and I am basically stumbling around in the dark trying to sort out how best to optimize the sound of my system in my room. So I’m happy to have the help. Let’s face it, at the end of the day we’re really just talking about record players and glorified FM radios! 😊

best, John

What the &$#@ is that supposed to imply, you (#@!%  *&&^$  $#@?  This isn't about fun, you $#+_%!

😅

Edited February 28, 2021 by BKDad

[jkmcc]

😂

That gave me my first big laugh of the morning as I sit down with my pot of tea!

[BKDad]

39 minutes ago, ctsooner said:

BK, you ADD so much to this forum.

I dunno about that, but I agree with the rest. 

True story:

At one time, I gave some thought to actually putting up a blog of some kind.  Or, maybe a series of YouTube presentations.  I was going to call it "This Olde Amplifier", which is an obvious play on the TV show.  

The idea was to talk about modernizing some older amplifiers that are fundamentally good (I was going to say "sound" there instead of good, but decided against it), but had some design flaws and probably could use some maintenance updates anyway.  I really hate the idea of perfectly good gear sitting on a shelf in somebody's basement for years collecting dust or getting dumped into a landfill.  The original owner may not have interest in the whatever any longer, but somebody might.  Waste like that may be good for some audio company's commerce, but I suspect an equal number of the good companies would be happy to see their products make somebody happy, even if it isn't the original owner.

Also, I was going to talk about making simple measurements at home that are useful, like the acoustic signature of your listening room.  Or, how one can improve the sound of a Tivoli One table radio for about $5 or so and back it up with actual measurements.  It's now possible to make many of the same measurements of electronics at home that JA does for the Stereophile "Measurements" portion of product reviews.   The investment for the test gear is way less than what people pay for a pair of interconnect or speaker cables.

A big idea was to share a bunch of information about computer simulation of electronics and designing your own gear, based around actual examples.  (Not loudspeakers, because I am dumb about that subject.)  Hobbyists can do a lot now for, ahh, hobbyist amounts of money that was almost impossible for professionals a couple decades ago.  Fixing gear and building your own can be rewarding unto itself.  I know people who tinker with bicycles for that reason.  They like doing that as much or more than riding.  Giving a kid or somebody with fewer resources the chance to ride can be very satisfying.

You probably get the idea.

Then I regained my sanity.  

First, just imagine the nightmare that would have become.  Think about the raging arguments that go on for years at many of the audio related web sites.  Nothing ever progresses, except the rancor.  Who needs that?

Second, I don't want to promote any notion that I might be more knowledgeable than other hobbyists.  It's a hobby for most of us.  An ego can be a healthy thing, but it also can be something worse.  I've read that a glass of wine every day can be healthy in a lot of ways.  We pretty much all know that a couple bottles each day can be a problem.  (Not a drinker, but I'm also not deaf nor blind.)  Same idea.  I may have spent more time looking at some objects than others, but that's it.  I'm content in that.

So, now I just try to offer some information for people to pursue on their own in areas I've looked at before.  That's the end of "about me".

[ctsooner]

Great story.  I would have loved it.  I like reading about anything audio even if it goes against what I believe as my own truths.