Vinyl / Turntables

[ursus13]

I know a few of you guys have owned a Basis table. I’d love your thoughts on ownership/experience. And, would you consider buying a Basis (or any turntable) on the used market?

[TomicTime]

i have had mixed results w used tables. New  gear , while not immune from issue, generally have better dealer support and warranty !. I had a Basis 1400 and worked thru an issue with motor shaft - hard to say anything bad about Basis customer support, parts, etc…. I ultimately sold it because the arm location greatly limited choice. I believe that limitation might be limited to the 1400 series only.

TT are a relatively complex mechanical device…bearings, springs, belts, etc wear out… so LEAP but have some $ in reserve to deal w potential issues…..

So my latest leap an E-Bay special turned into a New Zealand TT and a bit of detective work / minor surgery to get it operating on 60 hz / 120v….. asking yourself IF you want to tackle those opportunities BEFORE….if possible….

But fun and learning and music can be had !

[atlvalet]

So I am a vinyl noob, but at least wanted to go down the rabbit hole and I know there are plenty of people who have already done this lol

My other electronics are set. I purchased an Aragon 47K phono preamp to start out with (it's being hot rodded with a bunch of fancy stuff by the guy who rebuilt my Aragon amp and preamp...Modialfan on AK if anyone knows him).

I have done the basic Internet searches and was considering the Pro-Ject Debut Evo Carbon or Pro or the the Rega P3...don't think I want a Sota or VPI or one of the fancier ones at this point...but then I stumbled on the Clearaudio Concept turntable, and not only does it seem to be well built for "entry level" gear, it matches the aesthetics of my current gear (lame, I know lol).

Wondering people's thoughts. There is one with a Satisfy tonearm and CA MA cart, and there's one with a Verify tone arm and a (fancy to me) Hana SL cart.

Any thoughts or suggestions are appreciated. BTW, the system that my Vandy's are hooked up to is fully balanced, so this table will (most likely) be going through different speakers...and if I do put it through the 3A Sigs, I'll have to unhook the subs because they have the XLR high pass filters.

BTW, I forsee getting a fancier balanced turntable for the Vandy's at somepoint, but want to start simpler.

Thanks in advance.

[Holmz]

@atlvalet I am pretty sure that one can hookup an RCA TT to a balanced preamp.
It just takes a bit of a bespoke cable… or at least I did that with a balanced phone to RCA preamp.

[GdnrBob]

2 hours ago, atlvalet said:

..and if I do put it through the 3A Sigs, I'll have to unhook the subs because they have the XLR high pass filters.

You might be able to use some Jensen Transformers to go from RCA to XLR.

I haven't dabbled in turntables for years, but couldn't you connect the phono preamp to the phono inputs of the preamp?

B

[Holmz]

30 minutes ago, GdnrBob said:

You might be able to use some Jensen Transformers to go from RCA to XLR.

That would work.

 

30 minutes ago, GdnrBob said:

I haven't dabbled in turntables for years, but couldn't you connect the phono preamp to the phono inputs of the preamp?

B

Nah an outboard phone stage will apply RIAA, and be at line level.
Same as a preamp with a phono stage.

Like a Highlander episode… “there can only be one.”

[ctsooner]

I owned the Basis 1400.  I used a Nice Benz Glider and loved it with a Rhea phono.  The table is all about physics and it works.  Their current tables are all set up for their two top arms and not the Rega 300 rebuild.  You can't go wrong with Basis, but you MUST have a platform under it, like HRS or the like. It's a must to get the most out of it.

I LOVE the Clearaudio 'entry' table. Again, like Basis, you get a full sound, but it's neutral. Just doesn't add it's own signature.  I personally found the Rega tables a bit thin each time I heard them in different rigs.  that's all I got.

[atlvalet]

Appreciate your opinion/input. Between some saying motor noise can be an issue on Pro-ject tables and others feeling Rega's can sound "thin," I am now leaning heavily toward the Clearaudio Concept or a used Clearaudio Performance DC.

Thanks 🙂

[ctsooner]

I"m in the camp of Rega sounding very thin.  I purchased a Basis from Rutan instead of the Rega for that reason alone.  I LOVE the Clearaudio tables. Can't go wrong with any of them. Even the one with the phono stage built in sounded really nice to me when I was visiting a dealer in WI.  Keep us in the loop.  

[atlvalet]

Ok, I have a TT update.

Instead of a Concept I'm picking up a Clearaudio Performance DC at a great price ($1200) from a shop in Austin (not a Clearaudio dealer...on consignment from one of their customers).

Right now it has a very basic Ortofon OM 5E on it. Since I am a vinyl noob, I am looking for a cartridge that is probably a step or two up, but nothing crazy at this point. I want something that will be "good enough" for now, that won't immediately make me feel like upgrading.

If I were to give a budget, I'd say $100 to $150, but I'd say I could stretch to $200 for the right one. The OM 10 is ~$75 and the OM20 jumps to $200+.

It certainly doesn't have to be an Ortofon. I am open to try any MM or MC.

Also, Clearaudio doesn't publish the specs on their arms, but I've read the Verify carbon fiber is considered low mass.

BTW, my phono preamp will be a fairly modified Aragon 47K (Zfoils instead of Dale resistors, upgraded Audionote caps, etc).

Thanks in advance.

[TomicTime]

Nothing wrong w Ortofon…… Stretch for a Bronze would be my input…… Many Vandy dealers  carry Ortofon ….

Just my $.02 Congrats on the TT…..enjoy the 🎶 

[Holmz]

28 minutes ago, atlvalet said:

Ok, I have a TT update.

Instead of a Concept I'm picking up a Clearaudio Performance DC at a great price ($1200) from a shop in Austin (not a Clearaudio dealer...on consignment from one of their customers).

Right now it has a very basic Ortofon OM 5E on it. Since I am a vinyl noob, I am looking for a cartridge that is probably a step or two up, but nothing crazy at this point. I want something that will be "good enough" for now, that won't immediately make me feel like upgrading.

How does the OM 5E sound?

 

28 minutes ago, atlvalet said:

If I were to give a budget, I'd say $100 to $150, but I'd say I could stretch to $200 for the right one. The OM 10 is ~$75 and the OM20 jumps to $200+.

It certainly doesn't have to be an Ortofon. I am open to try any MM or MC.

Also, Clearaudio doesn't publish the specs on their arms, but I've read the Verify carbon fiber is considered low mass.

BTW, my phono preamp will be a fairly modified Aragon 47K (Zfoils instead of Dale resistors, upgraded Audionote caps, etc).

Thanks in advance.

But why?

Just get the thing going. There are always record cleaners and a ton of other crap you may not have planned on.
Like maybe some granite or low vibration platform to put it on.

The arm doesn’t look like it has a detachable head shell… otherwise that would have made it easier to go with a second cart.
(I think you would need another arm and arm board.., if that is even possible.)

Personally I would just run it for a month or three and take your time before noodling out on the next step.
It is likely you might think it is fine as is, or you may want a different cart then, than you think you want now.

There is sort of not info at the moment to make an informed decision, at least from the distance away that I am at.

Edited February 5, 2023 by Holmz

[atlvalet]

16 hours ago, Holmz said:

How does the OM 5E sound?

 

But why?

Just get the thing going. There are always record cleaners and a ton of other crap you may not have planned on. Like maybe some granite or low vibration platform to put it on.

This is probably the best advice someone could give me, so thanks.

I don't know how the OM 5E sounds as I won't be picking up the table for another few weeks.

Probably best to develop some experience with an inexpensive cart so I know what to listen for/to before moving up the chain.

And yeah, for dampening/isolation I'm planning on getting one of those IsoAcoustics maple boards with the feet because they seem to have good reviews and it will also match my Butcherblock Acoustics rack.

Appreciate the feedback.

[Holmz]

31 minutes ago, atlvalet said:

This is probably the best advice someone could give me, so thanks.

Thank gawd you thinks so, as I was thinking it might have been worded a bit rough.

 

31 minutes ago, atlvalet said:

…
I don't know how the OM 5E sounds as I won't be picking up the table for another few weeks.

Probably best to develop some experience with an inexpensive cart so I know what to listen for/to before moving up the chain.

Just getting a new cart aligned can cost more than the cart, or at least suck up some time.

 

31 minutes ago, atlvalet said:

And yeah, for dampening/isolation I'm planning on getting one of those IsoAcoustics maple boards with the feet because they seem to have good reviews and it will also match my Butcherblock Acoustics rack.

Appreciate the feedback.

There is usually a lot I forget about.
Do you have a record brush, stylus brush/cleaner and a scale?

I have the book, “The better sound of the phonograph”, by Robin Miller.
I’ll crack it open and see what is says..

[atlvalet]

22 hours ago, Holmz said:

There is usually a lot I forget about.

Do you have a record brush, stylus brush/cleaner and a scale?

I have the book, “The better sound of the phonograph”, by Robin Miller. I’ll crack it open and see what is says..

I have nothing yet 🙂

Starting from zero. I have one record LOL

On my "to-get" list so far is a Mobile Fidelity Geo Disk and one of these Zero Dust stylus cleaners.

https://www.turntablelab.com/products/onzow-zerodust-stylus-cleaner

Need some sort of basic record brush cleaner and will probably need a bunch of other things I haven't thought of.

[stratocaster]

6 hours ago, atlvalet said:

I have nothing yet 🙂

Starting from zero. I have one record LOL

 

@atlvalet be careful about what you are venturing into.... I was a digital guy until last year when I walked into my local Vandersteen dealer with the intent of exploring options for analog and walked out with a VPI Prime/Hana MH combo and now I have more lps than cds and am running out of room to store them. Not to mention all the tube electronics I ended up buying in the last 12 months...

 

All the technical stuff related to turntables that was mentioned in the earlier posts is way beyond my comprehension and I don't have the patience (or the bravado) to mess around with the cartridge/settings etc. however, I do wish that I had purchased a TT where the motor/tonearm etc. were all fixed on a single base and most importantly a TT that came with a cover that was convenient to place while not in use... (Feickert, Brinkman, Rega etc.). 

Enjoy the vinyl exploration.. it's stupid expensive but if you already have Vandersteen speakers, you are halfway there as far as musical enjoyment is concerned...

[atlvalet]

4 hours ago, stratocaster said:

@atlvalet be careful about what you are venturing into.... I was a digital guy until last year when I walked into my local Vandersteen dealer with the intent of exploring options for analog and walked out with a VPI Prime/Hana MH combo and now I have more lps than cds and am running out of room to store them. Not to mention all the tube electronics I ended up buying in the last 12 months...

Enjoy the vinyl exploration.. it's stupid expensive but if you already have Vandersteen speakers, you are halfway there as far as musical enjoyment is concerned...

Well, I have stupid covered. My credit card will deal with the expensive part 😄

Yeah, I had Adcom equipment for like 30 years. Was fine with it. Liked SS components. Then I bought an Audio Research LS-5 mkiii and heard tubes for the first time and now?

...now, I have 2 tube preamps, 2 tube integrated amps, and one EL-34 PP tube amp all within a year and a half LOL

Edited February 7, 2023 by atlvalet

[Holmz]

19 hours ago, atlvalet said:

I have nothing yet 🙂

Starting from zero. I have one record LOL

On my "to-get" list so far is a Mobile Fidelity Geo Disk and one of these Zero Dust stylus cleaners.

https://www.turntablelab.com/products/onzow-zerodust-stylus-cleaner

Need some sort of basic record brush cleaner and will probably need a bunch of other things I haven't thought of.

There is a record store in Long Beach (Ca) that the kiddies took me to.
They had a good selection of used stuff, and played some spotify of tracks while going through the stack.

And you could ship them off to the record cleaning fellow in Wisconsin or around there.

 

8 hours ago, atlvalet said:

Well, I have stupid covered. My credit card will deal with the expensive part 😄

I go slow covered. 😜
 

8 hours ago, atlvalet said:

Yeah, I had Adcom equipment for like 30 years. Was fine with it. Liked SS components. Then I bought an Audio Research LS-5 mkiii and heard tubes for the first time and now?

...now, I have 2 tube preamps, 2 tube integrated amps, and one EL-34 PP tube amp all within a year and a half LOL

Did you happen to try a pre into the Adcom?

[atlvalet]

I had an Adcom GTP-500 preamp/tuner with a GFA-555 ll with a set of 2Ci's that I had for years. Moved and sold that system due to COVID, and then went down a deep audio rabbit hole when I landed back on my feet.

Always lusted after the 3A Sigs after I heard them at a dealer. Flew to Seattle and drove a set back home when the guy lowered his price to $1500, which included two 2WQ subs. Couldn't pass up a price like that. Sold my Monitor Audio Silver 500's.

Now I have like 4 pairs of speakers and nine amplifiers. I'm not a hoarder, I swear. But give me an empty room and I'll fill it with audio equipment if no one stops me lol

[GdnrBob]

31 minutes ago, atlvalet said:

Always lusted after the 3A Sigs after I heard them at a dealer. Flew to Seattle and drove a set back home when the guy lowered his price to $1500, which included two 2WQ subs.

Wow, that was quite a deal!😲

Bob

[stratocaster]

17 minutes ago, GdnrBob said:

Wow, that was quite a deal!😲

Bob

Unbelievable deal...

[Mike Goetz]

It has been an interesting journey for me these last three years after getting back into vinyl.  Scrapping my old (1970s vintage) Technics DD table, I first tried the Pro-Ject Essential III with an Ortofon 2M Bronze, which satisfied the itch for a bit. As I built my collection with some great audiophile pressings from MoFi, Analogue Productions, Impex and others, the upgrade addiction kicked in. Now I am running a wonderful Music Hall MMF 9.3 table with an Ortofon 2M Black LVB cartridge.  Add a Pro-Ject Tube Box S2 phono preamp and Rogue Audio electronics and my 3A Signatures really sing. The itch seems mostly cured at this point except for all those spectacular vinyl pressings which show up on a regular basis. 

 

[atlvalet]

My brain saw that pic and went, "Ooooooh, shiny." 😍

[Steve Edwards]

On 2/7/2023 at 7:14 AM, Holmz said:

And you could ship them off to the record cleaning fellow in Wisconsin or around there.

atlvalet, here is the service Holmz is referencing.  I have used it numerous times; great results.  https://www.perfectvinylforever.com/

[TomicTime]

OP - A basic essential ( in what’s left of my mind anyway… ) vinyl setup and playback / maintenance kit would include:

Protractor   - The mentioned Geodisc can get good results IF you can properly sight the pivot point of the arm.  An alternate fave of mine is the old aluminum Denneson - sometimes found for low $ on ebay.

Blue painters tape to hold platter and Geodisc fixed in place !

Stylus force gage I have a Clearaudio but there are other less expensive that get job done w reasonable accuracy…

Last stylus cleaner or Audio Technica or whatever your cartridge manufacturer recommends - I use a combination of a dry brush, Last, AT, blue Tac, Magic Eraser, and DS audio…. on carts North of $3 K w good results. 

LP brush - Audioquest conductive handle CF brush… DRY

Bubble level !

Magnifier IF you cant see stylus / cantilever alignment in Geodisc or other protractor, readers or even stacked readers can work… !

Reference disc w strong center image to set antiskate by ear

Spin Clean and send a few reference LP to Perfect Vinyl Forever to hear what you might be missing without a US cleaner…. IF your cartridge can resolve it….

MoFi inner sleeves BUT only after you clean LP first…even NEW