Tube Single Ended for vandersteen 2Ce Signature II

[tomaneporto]

I'm thinking of a kit with 300B or 2a3 valves for my Vandys 2CE Signature II.

Does anyone in the group advise anyone in particular?

Are 86 db enough?

At the moment I have Pre "Conrad Johnson PV10A" and "Audioinnovations 1000 MK III"

[ctsooner]

On 4/7/2021 at 6:48 AM, tomaneporto said:

I'm thinking of a kit with 300B or 2a3 valves for my Vandys 2CE Signature II.

Does anyone in the group advise anyone in particular?

Are 86 db enough?

At the moment I have Pre "Conrad Johnson PV10A" and "Audioinnovations 1000 MK III"

Not sure I understand the question.  86 Db is the speakers sensitivity. Many run lower powered amps and love the sound. It depends on the current the amp provides as well as the room end how loudly you listen.  

[GdnrBob]

Well, if you have Vandy's, Atma-Sphere amps really make them shine.-though I am not sure about them being single ended tube amps.

Bob

[Steve Edwards]

My first pair of Vandy's came from a shop in Huntington Beach, CA (along with my LP12 and my PSE Studio V amps).  Steve Huntley, who had been the service manager at Audio Research, was an occasional employee.  Though I've never had any experience with them, he was a huge fan of Atma-Sphere amps and continually recommended them.  At that time (mid 80's), they offered DIY kits, as well as fully assembled units.

[TomicTime]

well.....that is a tough question but in general the 300B tube is capable of about 8 watts as i recall.....so unless you are listening at pretty low levels in a small space, i would strongly advise against that.  I have heard Model 2 sing with as few as 40 wpc ( Mac 240 ) and of course a super popular tube amp designed and “ voiced “ on the Two is the Music Reference RM-9 of 100 wpc.

 

[Holmz]

On 4/12/2021 at 11:04 PM, Steve Edwards said:

My first pair of Vandy's came from a shop in Huntington Beach, CA (along with my LP12 and my PSE Studio V amps).  Steve Huntley, who had been the service manager at Audio Research, was an occasional employee.  Though I've never had any experience with them, he was a huge fan of Atma-Sphere amps and continually recommended them.  At that time (mid 80's), they offered DIY kits, as well as fully assembled units.

What shop was that?
I recall that there was a Linn shop off of Bolsa Chica or somewhere WNW of Marina HS.
And I also recall the PSE gear up in Santa Monica where the ballet studio  was.. I think it was Optimnal Enchantment, and the fellow there was a Randall?

Does anyone have success running a bi-amp with a beefier amp on the woofer side and a tube amp on the upper registers?
Or is it not even worth a try?

[ctsooner]

Optimal Enchantment is Randy and he's still there.  He's a long time Vandy dealer.  As for bi amping, I heard that once and didn't like what I heard.  It's probably because the amps were the wrong ones to do this with. Bruce was using the larger Krell 250 if I recall.  The tube amp was the Audio Research amp.  None of us like what we heard, but maybe they didnt' do it properly.

[Steve Edwards]

13 hours ago, Holmz said:

What shop was that?
I recall that there was a Linn shop off of Bolsa Chica or somewhere WNW of Marina HS.
And I also recall the PSE gear up in Santa Monica where the ballet studio  was.. I think it was Optimnal Enchantment, and the fellow there was a Randall?

Does anyone have success running a bi-amp with a beefier amp on the woofer side and a tube amp on the upper registers?
Or is it not even worth a try?

Yes Holmz, it was Havens and Hardesty, off of Bolsa Chica.  I believe Richard Hardesty was one of RV's first dealers in Southern California.  He was a wealth of informed and trustworthy guidance.  

[GdnrBob]

Atmasphere and Mr. V's amp (as well as Ayre), use Zero Feedback design.

For some reason, zero feedback and Vandy speakers seem to be a match made in heaven.

 

It's too bad that I abandoned my stereo journey during the mid '80's until 2015 (no money...), there were some very interesting people I wish I could have learned from.

B

[TomicTime]

i bought my 3a-sig from Curtis Havens, he moved and started Advanced Audio in Tacoma…He retired and sold the business. It is thriving and carry Vandersteen to this day with great service.

[ctsooner]

That's a great story.  I miss my buddy Bruce Kutin who was in Providence, RI on the Brown campus.  Has ProAc (what I owned), Spendor's and Vandy's (also Apogee).  He never has the Steen's set up properly as I went to buy a pair of 2's and walked out with demo ProAc Super Towers.  They were fine, but I felt the magic when I heard the Treo's and the rest is history, lol.  I have been in touch with Bruce a few times over the years.  not sure if any of you knew the store or not.

[Ken K]

Hello All.  I actually bought Bruce's demo pair of 2ce sigs back around 2000 or so when he was dropping the brand.  I remember Bruce saying people came in to hear Vandersteens and left with ProAcs.   I finally boxed them up this past spring when a pair of Quatros took their place.  I still have the VPI table and arm that my father purchased from Bruce.  I visited his shop a few times after he moved to Cranston, but by that time he was not a Vandersteen dealer, though he carried the Benz line of cartridges that I was partial to. 

[ctsooner]

Yes I went in to buy the 3’s and left woth Pro Acs. He never set them up properly. He and Dwight weren’t the best set up guys. Tables, yes.  Speakers.  No

[ctsooner]

On 8/26/2021 at 8:10 AM, Ken K said:

Hello All.  I actually bought Bruce's demo pair of 2ce sigs back around 2000 or so when he was dropping the brand.  I remember Bruce saying people came in to hear Vandersteens and left with ProAcs.   I finally boxed them up this past spring when a pair of Quatros took their place.  I still have the VPI table and arm that my father purchased from Bruce.  I visited his shop a few times after he moved to Cranston, but by that time he was not a Vandersteen dealer, though he carried the Benz line of cartridges that I was partial to. 

 

 

[Richard Vandersteen]

On 8/25/2021 at 2:52 PM, Steve Edwards said:

Yes Holmz, it was Havens and Hardesty, off of Bolsa Chica.  I believe Richard Hardesty was one of RV's first dealers in Southern California.  He was a wealth of informed and trustworthy guidance.  

This will not work!  The last thing we would want is a change of amp character smack in the middle of the midrange where the ear is most sensitive.  As it is we use our strange way of running all of our sub-woofers in order to pass on amp character and that is in the bass.  My dad said many times "If it is to good to be true it probably isn't".   Best way to make a profound change is a better source or a better speaker as amplifiers are important but subtle in comparison.  Happy listening.

RV

[GdnrBob]

The OP hasn't posted since the initial post, so perhaps all our words are for naught.

B

[Holmz]

8 hours ago, GdnrBob said:

The OP hasn't posted since the initial post, so perhaps all our words are for naught.

B

 

Our additional jabbering is still handy for me 😉 even if the OP has vanished.

I got a PrimaLuna and need to switch the transformer taps to 230v (from 110v). I have a good window for that in maybe in two weeks.
Then I saw talk about Untralinear and triode (or maybe tetrode), so a couple of amp settings.

Then they also can take KT88, KT120 or KT150 so there is some “hot rodding” of the amp that I can do.
I do not always listen to it loudly, so I’ll have to try it and figure what it is that I want to fix…if anything. 

My HDMI AVR-processor is shipping now, so I’ll also have to do later.
And I’ll need to source the VCC. I am hoping I can find a used one, but I might just break down get it new. The price seems fair, but the cables and surrounds always add more than one imagines when they start with a zero in those spreadsheet columns.

i guess the question is - do I run the trub amp at the ~35W or the 48W setting? And has anyone tube rolled the amps and have impressions on KT120/KT150 versus EL34?
(yeah - I am sure I need to answer my own questions… which goes back to taking the advice that I usually give to others 😉 )

[ctsooner]

5 hours ago, Holmz said:

 

Our additional jabbering is still handy for me 😉 even if the OP has vanished.

I got a PrimaLuna and need to switch the transformer taps to 230v (from 110v). I have a good window for that in maybe in two weeks.
Then I saw talk about Untralinear and triode (or maybe tetrode), so a couple of amp settings.

Then they also can take KT88, KT120 or KT150 so there is some “hot rodding” of the amp that I can do.
I do not always listen to it loudly, so I’ll have to try it and figure what it is that I want to fix…if anything. 

My HDMI AVR-processor is shipping now, so I’ll also have to do later.
And I’ll need to source the VCC. I am hoping I can find a used one, but I might just break down get it new. The price seems fair, but the cables and surrounds always add more than one imagines when they start with a zero in those spreadsheet columns.

i guess the question is - do I run the trub amp at the ~35W or the 48W setting? And has anyone tube rolled the amps and have impressions on KT120/KT150 versus EL34?
(yeah - I am sure I need to answer my own questions… which goes back to taking the advice that I usually give to others 😉 )

We obsess because we obsess.  It’s what drives the online community. It’s also good though as it’s positive as we get music out of it all. 
 

As for buying used or new, I would think it’s rare to find a used center as there aren’t so many out there and folks who own late model Steens keep them.  I have only purchased speakers used once and it was from someone I knew well.  
 

keep us posted either way. Hope you can find a used one quickly, but if not I’m sure your dealer will be happy. Lol. 

[Holmz]

My dealer is 2000km away, but they are good.
I’ll get the amp working and that 5.1 AVR deal… 

Someone may be moving from a VCC2 to a VCC5, or I will just get it outright.

It depends on whether SWMBO abides the speakers beside the TV.
If that answer is “no”, then I am not getting a centre channel and the AVR for the house with the wood floors…

I am also renting a place that I am now flying to for work, so i can have a glorified man cave if need be.\

But back I to the amp…. And the tubes?? 

[tomaneporto]

On 9/4/2021 at 9:57 PM, GdnrBob said:

The OP hasn't posted since the initial post, so perhaps all our words are for naught.

B

Of course not 🤨
Ctsooner's answer enlightens me.
I have overhauled the Audioinnovations specially replacing ECC82 by ECC802 and ECC83 by ECC803 and I was amazed.
For now they are more than enough.
Thank you all.

tomaneporto

[ctsooner]

2 hours ago, tomaneporto said:

Of course not 🤨
Ctsooner's answer enlightens me.
I have overhauled the Audioinnovations specially replacing ECC82 by ECC802 and ECC83 by ECC803 and I was amazed.
For now they are more than enough.
Thank you all.

tomaneporto

Sounds like you are happy. That’s the key and many forget that. Have a plan and stick to it. Not easy, but important. If you change plans, then just make sure it’s kind of sensible for you and that you want it. Used or new.