Peter C Posted March 9 Share Posted March 9 (edited) I just moved to a new house with a 15 * 23 * 8 ft family room. I just tried three different arrangements and I’ve settled on the long wall because at 15 feet wide, I can get far enough way to get an approximate equilateral triangle with speakers about 11 feet apart, straddling the fireplace. I really like the 6 foot sidewall distance from each speaker, for improved imaging and longer reflection delay. I’m hoping not to use any room treatment in this larger room than what I had. Correction - I’m not allowed to use treatment other than furniture. There’s zero WAF in that anyway. I no longer have a man cave in the basement like I did at my previous house. For fine tuning of speaker placement, I’ve found these little dolly’s I bought at Home Depot, three under each speaker, to be a godsend. Edited March 9 by Peter C Add photos 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schuesmp Posted March 9 Share Posted March 9 A process with which I am highly familiar. The Vandersteen powered bass section with EQ is capable of mitigating so many in-room issues. If you stick with placement along the long wall, perhaps your partner would support hanging several absorptive art pieces on the back wall (e.g., stretched canvas with foam or fiberglass fill), which may help further with reducing unwanted reflections. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 I'm just glad the Steen's are fairly easy to place. Especially the dialed in sub 100hz. that's been a Godsend in my loft. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GdnrBob Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 Second Pic doesn't seem to be showing-just black. Looking at the dollies, I bet a 3 inch granite slab would work under them subs when you finally dial them in.😊 B 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter C Posted March 14 Author Share Posted March 14 System pics showing final placement. I can't seem to edit my previous post to remove the failed upload - I guess it was too large. They're out 30" from that side wall, about 10.5 feet apart and 12 feet from listening chair. I did a lot of experimenting with the 1/7 and 1/9's placement, 26 and 36 inches as starting points, before I ended up at 30". The image depth just seemed to lock in, based on that recording in Stereophile Test CD 2, where the guy claps as he goes to the back of the church and then back to the mic up front. Other listening confirmed that placement. But the key improvement I'm sensing now is from the much greater room volume and a good six or seven feet from left and right to the side walls. The midrange smoothness is much better and all drivers seem better integrated, compared to my old room where I could not get them further away than about 3 feet from the sidewalls and my ceiling height was just under 7 feet. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter C Posted March 14 Author Share Posted March 14 A couple of other issues I've dealt with: - Apparent DC leakage on the line, causing magnetostriction in the M5-HPA transformers. Unfortunately, my Audioquest Niagara 5000, my preferred power conditioner for the amps and built-in subs, does nothing for that. My PS Audio P20, however does remove almost all of it. The subs are now plugged directly into the wall. It's not a grounding issue because it persisted after lifting the ground with a cheater plug. I plan on shutting breakers off one by one to see if the problem is internal. I've heard of someone who's similar problem was fixed by replacement of the old service meter, which was faulty in that way. Maybe a transformer on the external chain is an issue? I could try the "HumBuster" ahead of the AQ 5000, at an added expense. - A little bit off balance louder volume to the left side, due to a large hole on the right, being an L shaped room that forms the eat in kitchen. I have mitigated the problem mostly by putting a folding screen just to the left of my listening chair to scatter the sound. I will proceed very cautiously with room treatment. Ideally, I'd like none at all, both due to WAF and even I don't want my room to look ugly. Like my temporary rug? A couple of blankets seem to be working well. Next is bass tuning, but honestly in this room, there will be little to tweak. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stratocaster Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 @Peter C you are lucky to have such a room without any furniture and clutter constraints to navigate through. Beautiful setup and am curious to learn from your experimentation with that off balance volume. I have a similar problem but it’s from the right hand side of my room. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oregon Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 It would be interesting to read your thoughts on the sound difference between rooms, particularly the loudspeaker's ability to "pressurive" the new, larger room. Thanks for sharing, Cody Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter C Posted March 15 Author Share Posted March 15 The speakers fill the room with dense, smooth and detailed sound rather easily, and that’s with M5-HPAs, not the twice as powerful M7-HPA’s. I believe not having any sound absorption panels and little sound absorption overall is allowing me to not have to crank the volume up any more than I did in my smaller room. It’s incredible how different the system sounds in this room. As I mentioned before the response is more even and not peaky, as it could be in the midrange in my old smaller room no matter what I tried. Because my chair is up against the back wall, the bass is augmented. I have yet to set the bass equalization. I’m a bit concerned that if I tame the peaks as recommended where I sit, that the bass will be weak if I shift my chair inward. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomicTime Posted March 15 Share Posted March 15 A whisker of toe in MAY cure the imbalance 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFW Posted March 15 Share Posted March 15 I also have M5-HPAs that exhibit hum due to some sort of DC leakage. Both amps are powered by separate PS Audio P5 power plants plugged into dedicated circuits. The hum from one is a bit louder than the other. Please let me know what you find as you investigate your system, I will do the same. Brian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter C Posted March 15 Author Share Posted March 15 52 minutes ago, TomicTime said: A whisker of toe in MAY cure the imbalance Yes I have the right toe’d in slightly more hen the left, 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DividedSky Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 (edited) On 3/15/2024 at 5:51 PM, TomicTime said: A whisker of toe in MAY cure the imbalance To play with toe in, I've had good luck using small plastic furniture slides under just the front two cone anchors. With the Kentos having one cone anchor in the back, it keeps the speakers in place but allows very easy toe in adjustment. Of course it slightly affects the speaker tilt which I know is of extreme importance for imaging, but i found I was still in the good window at my listening position. I tested that by sitting on a pillow or two to raise my listening position accordingly and found everything sounded the same. As you may guess, when toe in is set, it was a little tricky to remove them while assuring the position of the speaker didn't move at all. For that I had best results getting a helper. I tilt the speaker slightly away from me while the other person secures the side it is being tilted towards. Removing the last slider is easier as the two spikes hold the speaker secure when tilting to remove the second slider. My surface is a very large rug, so YMMV on hard wood. Edited March 20 by DividedSky 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghamilton Posted March 23 Share Posted March 23 Awsome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 On 3/16/2024 at 8:15 AM, Peter C said: Yes I have the right toe’d in slightly more hen the left, If the left is bouncing off the wall, and the right is not, then would toeing in the left one help? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Vandersteen Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 2 hours ago, Holmz said: If the left is bouncing off the wall, and the right is not, then would toeing in the left one help? Easy to try! Mark where they are and try it, if it doesn't work put it back. RV 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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