dminches Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 What upgraded-from-stock power cords are people using with their Vandersteen subwoofers? The challenge is finding a cord whose IEC 15 connector fits within the subwoofer amp’s fins. Anything much larger than a stock IEC15 will not fit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKDad Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 I built my own. They are similar in design to some older TG Audio cables. I used Acme IEC15 connectors, which aren't available any longer. I'm not sure TG Audio is around any longer, either. That's probably not much help... But, I see Furutech now makes suitable connectors. The model number is FI-C15. Available in expensive gold and more expensive rhodium models with some special ceramic particles in the housing. I may change over, just because. Might be a good winter project if/when the snow flies. https://www.vhaudio.com/furutech-fi-c15.html Ye Olde Cable Company seems to have some cables with connectors that look to be the same size as stock IEC15's. I have no experience with them, but it may be a starting point for your search. That's also probably not much help... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 Audioquest has a few of the Furetech connectors. They can make any of their cords fit IF you talk them into doing it, lol. Honestly, the Blizzard from AQ will fit and sound great. I'll be upgrading the Quatro cables AFTER I get right side up from getting the M5 amps, lol. Great to see you over here Dminches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKDad Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 I'll be buying these AQ cables right after I buy an Aston Martin. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 LOL... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKDad Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 That's actually pretty close. The pragmatic problem is that my wife couldn't really get into or out a car like that very well, due to her hips. Even a Porsche 911 would be hard. Life is full of compromises. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 I have MS and wasn't able to look at these smaller cars for similar reason, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKDad Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 Yeah. It's not the size, per se. It's lowering yourself into the seats and hoisting yourself out. I'm good with that, but she definitely isn't. In this case, they're also not exactly inexpensive - not in our normal budget. Plus, the nearest dealer is in Greenwich. That's as bad as buying audio gear. Pfui. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 Oh I totally get it. Can't get in and out of lower vehicles. Totally sucks as it cuts so many options. Even getting in and out of some smaller sedans are difficult. I just got an SUV when my lease for a sedan was up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Edwards Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 ct, eagerly awaiting your observations when you upgrade your Quatro cables. I've been considering upgrading my power cables for a while now; still deciding whether to do my amps or my Quatros (stock now on the Quatros, Morrow MAP3 on my PSE Studio V mono amps). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dminches Posted November 21, 2020 Author Share Posted November 21, 2020 I upgraded the power cords for my M7-HPAs and it made a huge difference. I got a pair of Hurricanes from Johnny R at Audio Connection. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKDad Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 2 hours ago, Steve Edwards said: ct, eagerly awaiting your observations when you upgrade your Quatro cables. I've been considering upgrading my power cables for a while now; still deciding whether to do my amps or my Quatros (stock now on the Quatros, Morrow MAP3 on my PSE Studio V mono amps). I upgraded the subwoofer power cables within a month or so of buying the Quatro's. We were having too much fun just listening... The new cables made a very noticeable and worthwhile difference. At least, to me. The cables I'm using are kind of a home recipe based on some discussions with the late Bob Crump when he was still alive. TG Audio power cables may be similar. I'm not sure if TG is still around, though. I use the same recipe throughout the entire system, with the exception of the power amp (It's a Tiffany TPC-60 with new connectors - a gift from the designer who is a childhood buddy of mine. Good luck finding any now.) and the Apple TV and cable TV box. The latter use C7 IECs, so of necessity they are different. One of the downsides of playing with audio systems is that there are way too many variables, many of which are dependent. It's easy to get lost down a bunch of rabbit holes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 Yes a ton of variables. That's why cords and cables are a bit different than components, but man do they make a difference. I will be needing to sell my 2m run of the hurricane power cord as my set up is so different. I'll then probably get a pair of Blizzard for the Quatro's and then whatever I can afford for the amps. I have a Basis cord that AJ game me before he passed that I may use on the Server/DAC/volume and then I'd have two Hurricanes for the amps. I'll have to see what works best after the new outlets are moved behind the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKDad Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 That's what I mean. You could spend a lifetime juggling all the possibilities. But, whatever wets your whistle! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 I don't love doing auditions that much. I do them when I'm serious about making changes and when asked to (ie folks send gear to listen to or bring it over). it can be a lot of fun, but it's time consuming. I'd rather listen to music 90% of the time. I know I love a product when I can start off auditioning and then I realize I haven't made any notes and I still have music playing, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Gallup Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 Was thinking about this today while swimming my (socially distanced) laps at the high school outdoor pool. My old system (not counting streamer, DAC, TT) of Treo CTs and a VTL integrated amp had one power cord . Now with the Quatro CTs, M5-HPAs and a preamp, I've added four new ones, and not in the most convenient locations. The ones I've been using are home-made with Furutech plugs and DH Labs 3x12awg cable. Four new six footers come in at about $1400 plus shipping. Ouch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKDad Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 Outdoor pool? Schools don't even consider such around here. Anyway, I think what you've observed is why there is a strong bias amongst certain people basically denying that cables can possibly make a difference, based on surface level engineering analysis. Perhaps this is part of the reason for the popularity of headphone used systems. No high power anything, no room acoustics to deal with, pretty much no bothering anybody else (or them bothering you...), and fewer power cords. What's not to like? Umm, maybe the sound? Forgetting the technical analysis, I basically figure that putting good supports under loudspeakers and using good cabling is akin to putting proper tires on a Corvette or Porsche. Throwing money at the solution is no guaranty of success or even better performance. It's just a guaranty of spending more. But, if you don't get the right tires all the rest is going to underperform. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 Great way to look at it. I wasn't a power cord believer per say until I met Garth. His designs are special and well worth the coin if you have it. They are still AFTER proper components and room treatment (if you are able to). I wish I could do treatments, but it's also the wife's room and that's not happening. Glad the room sound ok. Not great, but at least ok. For me, it's like having to drive the cars with all weather tires. A bit of a compromise, but still make FOR the vehicle and getting 90% instead of summer tires and 100%. I now have to get new females plugs retrofitted since the current ones don't work. darn it. lol. Just going to mono blocks has made a huge change from having new outlets installed behind the system to having to change out the power cord plugs. I bought an 8' run of William Tell true bi wire cables when I only needed a 3' run now that I have mono blocks, but then I'd have had to change my WEL interconnects as they are only 1m long. I just decided to keep the amps within a meter of the server/dac and and deal with the excess speaker cables. The fog lifters are in place for the speaker cables at least. I'm going to hide the excess cables and cords with small house plants, lol. Crazy hobby for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKDad Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 We've been using what I'll call optimized power cables for about 30 years now. A friend of mine owned a small specialty cable manufacturing company and was an audiophile. His son, also a buddy and an audiophile, designed some cables based on basic engineering premises that he actually got patented. They OEM'ed those cables to more than one famous audio cable specialist. (I'll leave names out of this.) They gave me a couple of the cables to try. Yup - immediate and noticeable improvement. In fact, I still use them where I am able to because they still beat the heck out of most every cable I've tried since. I had no expectation bias either way - I didn't have any money invested or any other mitigating ideas. If they were no better, at worst I could rag on my friend. But, they were instantly heard to be better. I learned an awful lot about what cables do and don't do with that experience. I learned even more about the overall cable biz. As for acoustic treatments, my own experience is that doing a modest amount based on real science easily has as much positive effect as changing loudspeakers or electronics. I was fortunate to find suitable acoustic treatments that my wife actually finds attractive - they have become part of the "artwork" on our living room wall. Is the room perfect? Almost certainly not, but I'm ok with Quatro CT's instead of a System Nine, too. Engineering is about optimizing the inevitable compromises. I was thinking just a couple days ago that getting the room right, getting the AC mains wiring right with suitable filtering, and proper set-up is probably around half the home audio puzzle. That's probably subversive thinking, but I've been cooped up the last few months... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 I love the response. Yes, the cable industry from day one was littered with hacks and snake oil sales people. That's why so many honest cable companies have to fight that daily and always will. Nature of that beast. Set up is a HUGE part of things. I wish I was better at that part of things. I have a couple of 'room hot spots' that could use help. It's a brutal room as it's a loft with openings to the stair case down and 50" half wall behind the speakers. I do sit near field (10' 6" away from each tweeter) so that helps I think. I have a couple of quilts in certain places, but need to build something that covers the railing into the loft that has room treatments on it. Just not sure what to use there etc.. I may be better off using a quilt on the wall of the stairs where the first reflection is. I may also build a treatment that sits in the window on the left side speaker to cover that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKDad Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 There's probably a solution for your acoustic situation. In my view, people often tend to put too much absorption into rooms. That isn't a very appealing sound quality to me. What we've done is to put tri-corner traps in the two front corners of the room. They go from floor to ceiling, pretty much. Behind the acoustic covering, there's also a scattering plate so that above a couple KHz, the sound is, ahh, scattered. Putting bass traps in the room corners I think tends to lower the "Q" of the listing room resonator. Then, we have some diffusers on the front walls. The back wall, such as it is since there's an up- and a down-staircase in the back of the room also has a bass trap on it with a scatter plate. Not perfect, of course, but it was practical for us and is a huge improvement over no treatment. The bass doesn't have nearly as many peaks or valleys in different parts of the room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 I couldn't fit bass traps if I wanted, lol. he has the speakers right in the corner of the room. I agree on too much absorption. I hate that. I probably need the side walls for 1st reflection adn diffusers on the opposite wall of the speakers. It's what Johnny Rutan said. I'll figure it out eventually, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dminches Posted December 3, 2020 Author Share Posted December 3, 2020 I have a dedicated listening room with 48 panels. A large portion of them are to control the bass. I had the entire room measured and configured by Jeff Hedback. To me, the most important panels are the bass traps and the diffusors at the point of first reflection on the side walls and ceiling. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKDad Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 8 minutes ago, dminches said: I have a dedicated listening room with 48 panels. A large portion of them are to control the bass. I had the entire room measured and configured by Jeff Hedback. To me, the most important panels are the bass traps and the diffusors at the point of first reflection on the side walls and ceiling. You're very fortunate to have high enough ceilings to do that. That must sound great! 👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKDad Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 13 minutes ago, ctsooner said: I couldn't fit bass traps if I wanted, lol. he has the speakers right in the corner of the room. I agree on too much absorption. I hate that. I probably need the side walls for 1st reflection adn diffusers on the opposite wall of the speakers. It's what Johnny Rutan said. I'll figure it out eventually, lol. I tried putting the speakers in the corners but didn't like the effect. But, I can imagine that a lot of people would. Nobody's wrong in this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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