dsisssup Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 Just got a line on an AX5. Some time ago Johnny Mentioned that it might do a better job than my AR ref-110 (tubes). Can anyone share experience with the AX5 and the connection of the external filters . I have the M5 HPB filters. Jordan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GdnrBob Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 I know that the AX-5 has a Twenty upgrade. If it is just a non-Twenty, then I wouldn't bother. Looking at HifiShark, AX-5 Twenty's go for $5-5.5 K. I have no experience with AR, but know they are very good companions with Vandersteen speakers. My 2 cents: Both amps are very good, perhaps some sound differences, but nothing significant to warrant a change. And, I would wait for a nice pair of Mr. V's M5 amps to come up for sale. Probably more money, but worth it in the long run. B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomicTime Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 i don’t think it’s a clear upgrade without a serious discussion of what you feel the 110 isn’t doing….. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 I’m not sure how often are going to see any M5’s on the used market. Niche product and the upgrad is 7 speakers with matching amp. Jmho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick D Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 21 hours ago, dsisssup said: Just got a line on an AX5. Some time ago Johnny Mentioned that it might do a better job than my AR ref-110 (tubes). Can anyone share experience with the AX5 and the connection of the external filters . I have the M5 HPB filters. Jordan A dear pal of mine has the AX-5 / Twenty Ayre amp powering his Quatro CTs and loves it. His preamp is an Audio Research Reference pre. He has the Vandy crossovers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrenter Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 So…the Ayre AX-5 is an integrated amp. There is not a “pre-amp out” / “amp in” option so the use of external Vandersteen crossovers is not (really) an option. However, you can send the AX-5 back to Ayre and have the appropriate crossover (basically a set of capacitors) inserted into the circuit. It’s a great option, but Richard (and others) believe a battery-biased crossover is more transparent. I haven’t been able to compare so I’ll trust their claim. I have no complaints (as my AX-5 / Twenty, as well as my previous AX-7e, have an Ayre installed crossover). Interesting a dealer would showcase the AX-5 / Twenty using an external pre-amp. I guess you could connect a pre-amp to an AX-5 (using external crossovers) if the input was configure for HT bypass. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick D Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 6 hours ago, Patrick D said: A dear pal of mine has the AX-5 / Twenty Ayre amp powering his Quatro CTs and loves it. His preamp is an Audio Research Reference pre. He has the Vandy crossovers. OOPS! Sorry...brain fart. He has the VX-5 / Twenty AMP. Not the integrated. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GdnrBob Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 23 hours ago, ctsooner said: I’m not sure how often are going to see any M5’s on the used market. Niche product and the upgrad is 7 speakers with matching amp. Jmho. It has been said: Patience is a virtue. Good things come to those who wait. And, Buying used saves a bit of cash (mine).😉 Though, at $15K, the M5 amps are quite a bargain. (If only my big client didn't move to another state, I'd have the amps and preamp on order...) B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsisssup Posted November 11, 2022 Author Share Posted November 11, 2022 On 11/9/2022 at 7:15 PM, Patrick D said: A dear pal of mine has the AX-5 / Twenty Ayre amp powering his Quatro CTs and loves it. His preamp is an Audio Research Reference pre. He has the Vandy crossovers. Yeah I understand AX-5 does a fine job with the Quatros. I'm moving slow because my Ref-110 does a great job as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomicTime Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 i don’t think it’s a clear upgrade without a serious discussion of what you feel the 110 isn’t doing…..;-) i agree…. i had an Ayre VX-R Twenty and …. the Ref110 is a fine amp….. I would explore putting it on an HRS platform and a few other tweaks to tubes…before i switched it out…. just my $1.50 Best Jim 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GdnrBob Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 Great points @TomicTime. And, I'd use that money to get some of the higher end AQ cables. The current SOTA cables are pretty much out of anyone's price range, but you should be able to get the models one step or two down the AQ line at a more reasonable price. Something like William Tell's for the speakers should be available used at a good discount. And, the WEL's for interconnects. bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomicTime Posted November 12, 2022 Share Posted November 12, 2022 i have the top three AQ IC’s in the system for evaluation…for a week now… Thunderbird, Firebird and Dragon, all in XLR….. while they are quite good, fantastic really and like an electronic component change… i would still strongly advise working your source and speakers… FIRST….. You can spend less $ and get more by moving UP a speaker in the Vandersteen line….assuming you have competent fairly neutral wire now…then get an optimized high pass amplifier .. Just my two cents…. I understand others will have different circumstances, priorities, desires , conclusions, WAF….. etc…. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick D Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 On 11/9/2022 at 4:15 PM, Patrick D said: A dear pal of mine has the AX-5 / Twenty Ayre amp powering his Quatro CTs and loves it. His preamp is an Audio Research Reference pre. He has the Vandy crossovers. OOPS- Meant the VX-5/Twenty amp. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 Always cables last. I"d listen to Jim on this one folks. As we see, he's constantly getting components in to audition. That's something many aren't able to do (you don't live near a shop). I had the AX5/20 with the built in crossover. They used the top caps that are used in the ref gear. I felt it was very transparent, but I never was able to listen to that vs the external/battery operated ones from Richard. If he says his are more transparent, I full believe him. I also was blown away by being able to switch from 8' cables to 1M ones when switching to the Vandy amps. Components first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomicTime Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 Thanks Pete….. as tempting as that cable upgrade was…i went a different way… TRYing to follow my own advice with $ put into cartridge…. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DividedSky Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 (edited) @TomicTime Forgive my obtuseness- so you auditioned the 3 mythical creatures and decided it wasn't enough of an upgrade to justify the $? What are your current ICs and did any of the three you auditioned tempt you? Did you consider sending the Koetsu to JR at Wallytools for analysis and custom shim? I can't recommend it highly enough, my results have been absolutely amazing on my Hana Umami Red Frank Edited February 29 by DividedSky 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomicTime Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 @DividedSky Hi Frank - to clarify a bit…. My current AQ cable in the System are Sky / Niagara for IC and a 5M run of Wild Blue to the M7. Very blessed to have those and they set a fairly high bar for transparency… I had an opportunity to live w the Mythical Creatures cables as my local appointment only dealer had just received them but would be away traveling. I really wasn’t shopping… but my friend has heard my system and trusts my ears. He asked me to evaluate them. During those two weeks I spent a lot of seat time working thru the pile against my well known baseline. My concluion after only testing IC not the run to the amp ( which = GNP of a small country ) The top 2 silver cables, while brutally expensive ARE a component level upgrade BUT i could erase about half that gain by removing the $1K investment in HRS Nimbus couplers under the ARC line stage and phono ( hint ! )…. For someone w system to resolve it they represent end game move… I loved the value the two copper cables provide ( although $$$$ has changed significantly w 2024 pricing and apparently the popularity of Garth’s work )…. my findings there were neck n neck w Sky trading that last bit of definition and refinement for warmth of tone and body. When i get diffusers hung in the new room and an electrical gremlin sorted , i’m sure to revisit this….. Hopefully this helps.. call anytime Jim 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomicTime Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 @DividedSky on the different question of the Koetsu….. Interestingly, i have significant seat time listening to a system front end ( Ortofon Verismo on a Kuzma 4 pt before and after the Wallytools shim. I think it was a good investment in that system, EVEN with the level of precision / quality assurance typical of Ortofon. I don’t expect the Koetsu to hold the same tolerance… i have good setup tools and help, so my approach will be to get a baseline ( WT / Azimuth block, etc… ) compare w my known baseline Kuzma CAR-40 on Dynavector DV-505…. and then possibly send to JR for the shim. glad to hear of your positive results. i always enjoy chatting w JR. Hopefully he makes it up to Pacific Audio Festival in the Fall. Jim 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DividedSky Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 2 hours ago, TomicTime said: @DividedSky Hi Frank - to clarify a bit…. My current AQ cable in the System are Sky / Niagara for IC and a 5M run of Wild Blue to the M7. Very blessed to have those and they set a fairly high bar for transparency… I had an opportunity to live w the Mythical Creatures cables as my local appointment only dealer had just received them but would be away traveling. I really wasn’t shopping… but my friend has heard my system and trusts my ears. He asked me to evaluate them. During those two weeks I spent a lot of seat time working thru the pile against my well known baseline. My concluion after only testing IC not the run to the amp ( which = GNP of a small country ) The top 2 silver cables, while brutally expensive ARE a component level upgrade BUT i could erase about half that gain by removing the $1K investment in HRS Nimbus couplers under the ARC line stage and phono ( hint ! )…. For someone w system to resolve it they represent end game move… I loved the value the two copper cables provide ( although $$$$ has changed significantly w 2024 pricing and apparently the popularity of Garth’s work )…. my findings there were neck n neck w Sky trading that last bit of definition and refinement for warmth of tone and body. That was a great opportunity to audition all in that series. Interesting that in the thread on speaker cables that RV also noted the improvements were somewhat modest (it at all) past Robin Hood up until the top 2 w silver. LOL on GNP small country for your 5 meter run. I'm curious about the HRS Nimbus. My Doshi V3.0 phonostage and preamp are a suspended chassis with isolation feet, so it's been said that extra isolation doesn't help them much. I saw people talk about using them with HRS suspension platforms. Have you heard of that? I'm using HRS M3X under my AMG Viella 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DividedSky Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 3 hours ago, TomicTime said: @DividedSky on the different question of the Koetsu….. Interestingly, i have significant seat time listening to a system front end ( Ortofon Verismo on a Kuzma 4 pt before and after the Wallytools shim. I think it was a good investment in that system, EVEN with the level of precision / quality assurance typical of Ortofon. I don’t expect the Koetsu to hold the same tolerance… i have good setup tools and help, so my approach will be to get a baseline ( WT / Azimuth block, etc… ) compare w my known baseline Kuzma CAR-40 on Dynavector DV-505…. and then possibly send to JR for the shim. glad to hear of your positive results. i always enjoy chatting w JR. Hopefully he makes it up to Pacific Audio Festival in the Fall. Jim It's wild that my Hana Red needed more than 7 degrees of correction for SRA. When I first got it, I futzed with it extensively using AnalogMagik and got azimuth dialed in fairly well and could tell my distortion scores improved as I brought the cart tail down on VTA/SRA but it was so touchy and any slight adjustment made the distortion scores crappy again. In listening, I just couldn't shake the sense that I wasn't getting the level of vibrancy and solid imaging that I should be. It was tricky because it sounded very very good, but didn't get to that transcendent place. Now that I know how much the SRA needed correcting, it makes total sense and the proof is in the riveting listening sessions. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DividedSky Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 7 minutes ago, DividedSky said: I'm curious about the HRS Nimbus. My Doshi V3.0 phonostage and preamp are a suspended chassis with isolation feet, so it's been said that extra isolation doesn't help them much. I saw people talk about using them with HRS suspension platforms. Have you heard of that? I'm using HRS M3X under my AMG Viella When I say using "them" with suspension platforms I mean the Nimbus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Vandersteen Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 3 hours ago, DividedSky said: That was a great opportunity to audition all in that series. Interesting that in the thread on speaker cables that RV also noted the improvements were somewhat modest (it at all) past Robin Hood up until the top 2 w silver. LOL on GNP small country for your 5 meter run. I'm curious about the HRS Nimbus. My Doshi V3.0 phonostage and preamp are a suspended chassis with isolation feet, so it's been said that extra isolation doesn't help them much. I saw people talk about using them with HRS suspension platforms. Have you heard of that? I'm using HRS M3X under my AMG Viella DividedSky, this is only true at 2.5 feet! As the speaker wires get longer the wire becomes logarithmically more important. XLR ICs are different once you take the hit with 1 meter you can go 7 meters without significant further degradation especially. RV 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomicTime Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 Generally you don’t want a spring on a spring…. so not sure Nimbus would help the Doshi IF they have that built in… could make things worse… The HRS TT platforms are fantastic for unsprung TT… love both of mine…. essential really. Good info on the Excel built Umami… i’ve heard only the Red ow twice… excellent sound both times… Most Vandy dealers carry HRS, possibly arrange a trial… I carry a set in my travel setup / tweak box… the 1”… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delkat Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 11 hours ago, TomicTime said: @DividedSky Hi Frank - to clarify a bit…. My current AQ cable in the System are Sky / Niagara for IC and a 5M run of Wild Blue to the M7. Very blessed to have those and they set a fairly high bar for transparency… I had an opportunity to live w the Mythical Creatures cables as my local appointment only dealer had just received them but would be away traveling. I really wasn’t shopping… but my friend has heard my system and trusts my ears. He asked me to evaluate them. During those two weeks I spent a lot of seat time working thru the pile against my well known baseline. My concluion after only testing IC not the run to the amp ( which = GNP of a small country ) The top 2 silver cables, while brutally expensive ARE a component level upgrade BUT i could erase about half that gain by removing the $1K investment in HRS Nimbus couplers under the ARC line stage and phono ( hint ! )…. For someone w system to resolve it they represent end game move… I loved the value the two copper cables provide ( although $$$$ has changed significantly w 2024 pricing and apparently the popularity of Garth’s work )…. my findings there were neck n neck w Sky trading that last bit of definition and refinement for warmth of tone and body. When i get diffusers hung in the new room and an electrical gremlin sorted , i’m sure to revisit this….. Hopefully this helps.. call anytime Jim Jim, Do you use the Nimbus on top of an HRS platform between the ARC phono stage and the platform? Just wondering how they are supposed to be used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomicTime Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 @Brad O should probably weigh in also as i suspect the preferred HRS solution would be = Component > Vortex > HRS base ( this is how i have my TT setup in Seattle ( the DP-75 ). The Ref phono and line stage are = Component > Nimbus ( tall enough so factory feet do not contact shelf ) > Hardwood Shelf. In California, i have Core Audio Design shelves w built in damping, the weigh about 30# each and configuration = Component > Nimbus > Core Shelf. The Brinkmann TT is direct to HRS base but the Brinkmann power supply configuration = Component > Panzerholty shelf > Nimbus Dont ask how i have the Vandersteen high pass filters configured…… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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