Holmz Posted August 26, 2021 Author Share Posted August 26, 2021 7 hours ago, GdnrBob said: … My fist take is to keep the TV in the corner, and angle the sofa, 'She who must be obeyed' seems to have made this a non-starter (Though, I think you should try it, and see if it looks and sounds reasonable). Or, - And, I think this would be my choice- is to remove the shelf above the fireplace and put the TV just above the fireplace. (BTW- is it working? Gas or wood burning?). Having the furniture angled toward the fireplace would look very comfy and would make more sense as the hearth is the main focus of the room. (BTW- I had my partner look at your photos and he agrees. He also has a better grasp of using space. We both worked at homes designed with Parrish-Hadley, so some of this rubbed off. If you could have seen the 'Movie Room' at the Whitney's house in Manhasset, you would understand). There is a small door opposite the window, near the small door at the opposing end- from the DR, where does that go to? Bob The fireplace works, but we have not used it. I’ll give them hearth idea whirl. I could put the center channel below it, just the L/R speakers srcould start to get a WAF “F” score. So one comes in the front door, through a large open room . The the lounge and dining room. so looking to the right from the dining room, or left from the front door… There is a long hallway which comes off of that first entry room, and a door in both the lounge and dining room feed into it. There are 4 bedrooms off of that central hallway and a kitchen and a bath are out of the dining room door. The hallway is about 6ft wide… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted August 26, 2021 Author Share Posted August 26, 2021 @GdnrBob The hallway when look from next to the dining room towards the front of the house… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted August 26, 2021 Author Share Posted August 26, 2021 I was thinking of a full spectrum center channel, and when I looked up I noticed a sign from the heavens pointing directly to where I am considering putting a VCC2. If this is not heavenly confirmation bias, then I do not know what would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stratocaster Posted August 26, 2021 Share Posted August 26, 2021 @HolmzI have dabbled a lot more in home theater than I have in two channel thanks to the kids and their movies/gaming endeavors. And for most part, I have always used surround sound even for regular tv programs since the pathetic sound quality from the televisions has always put me off. Based on your room configuration and seating options, putting a lot of speakers is going to be counter intuitive and be more of a nuisance (placement and sound wise) than the benefits that you will be able to get. Depending on your seating arrangement across the window, the length of the couch/sofa you are going to sit on and lastly the wall behind you, the best option is to go with 3.1 setup. It's all going to boil down to how slick your processor is in recreating surround sound from a stereo + center channel + sub setup. Another suggestion based on my personal experience is to place the center channel behind you under the couch. Sounds stupid but I do that whenever my dad visits me for extended periods. He is hard of hearing and wears a hearing aid. He used to complain that he couldn't hear the dialogues since the volume is low and didn't like turning up the volume to avoid disturbing the rest of the household. When I saw him watching movies with no volume and just the subtitles on, I had to figure something out.. Having center channel in the back and on the floor did wonders. I did have to play around with the delay and sound level settings in the processor but it was very easy. Anyway, keep us posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted August 27, 2021 Author Share Posted August 27, 2021 10 hours ago, stratocaster said: @HolmzI have dabbled a lot more in home theater than I have in two channel thanks to the kids and their movies/gaming endeavors. And for most part, I have always used surround sound even for regular tv programs since the pathetic sound quality from the televisions has always put me off. Based on your room configuration and seating options, putting a lot of speakers is going to be counter intuitive and be more of a nuisance (placement and sound wise) than the benefits that you will be able to get. Depending on your seating arrangement across the window, the length of the couch/sofa you are going to sit on and lastly the wall behind you, the best option is to go with 3.1 setup. It's all going to boil down to how slick your processor is in recreating surround sound from a stereo + center channel + sub setup. Another suggestion based on my personal experience is to place the center channel behind you under the couch. Sounds stupid but I do that whenever my dad visits me for extended periods. He is hard of hearing and wears a hearing aid. He used to complain that he couldn't hear the dialogues since the volume is low and didn't like turning up the volume to avoid disturbing the rest of the household. When I saw him watching movies with no volume and just the subtitles on, I had to figure something out.. Having center channel in the back and on the floor did wonders. I did have to play around with the delay and sound level settings in the processor but it was very easy. Anyway, keep us posted. Thanks. I am better at giving advise than taking it... and it is usually easier to see other problems from the advantage of some distance and not being involved in the middle of it. So (Thanks) this testing approach seems like a it makes sense for me to read in B&W. The processor is supposed to be slick enough, so I’ll start with the 3.1 (or 3.2/3.3) and see how it goes. Is there something other than REW and ears that you use? Specifically do you look at early reflections with an autocorrelation, or just listen? (I’ll use REW for the subs) At some point I’ll likely take a Forster bit and put Neutrik XLRs to the floor to get signals to the subs by running the cables under the floor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted August 30, 2021 Author Share Posted August 30, 2021 On 8/26/2021 at 7:34 AM, GdnrBob said: … Or, - And, I think this would be my choice- is to remove the shelf above the fireplace and put the TV just above the fireplace. … Bob We moved the TV to the hearth for her to try. And the area under it would suit a VCC2 I think. So we will see what she thinks of that spot… had to go get a longer antenna cable and got to listen to a sound bar. That was too bright (for me) and for her, so I suspect that a VCC may be an easier sell. She said she would not take that sound bar even if it is was given away for free. She literally took 4 steps backwards when it started playing . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkeske Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 (edited) Lol. I’ve thought about a sound bar as well, but have decided to maintain my separate 2 channel and HT system living in harmony via AVR pre-outs and the pass-thru on my 2 channel preamp. Works great. Nice to have HT when listening/streaming the Berlin Philharmonic live, as I did this past Friday. And with my main 2CE Sigs taking the front/main 2 channel role, and 1C’s for the rears, and orphan ELAC center in HT, it sounds great when I do the HT thing. Fills the room nicely when doing so. Edited August 31, 2021 by bkeske 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 I use a Bluesound sound bar in the bedroom and it works great. Would I want it on my main system? Even with the matching sub, it's just not even close. I don't bother with a center as I love the 2 channel and it's still fine for my movie watching, but when I have heard the Vandy cinema set up, it was awesome. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GdnrBob Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 I really have to get started on improving my TV sound. My major impediment is that I hardly watch TV anymore. I'd rather listen to music on my stereo system. B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted August 31, 2021 Author Share Posted August 31, 2021 2 hours ago, GdnrBob said: I really have to get started on improving my TV sound. My major impediment is that I hardly watch TV anymore. I'd rather listen to music on my stereo system. B I wish I could say ^that^, less musi but more streaming TV series… So i have to adapt. The PrimaLuna that my friend sent needs to be hooked up, Does anyone have experience with these and can recommend which mode to use? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stratocaster Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 On 8/26/2021 at 6:09 PM, Holmz said: Is there something other than REW and ears that you use? Specifically do you look at early reflections with an autocorrelation, or just listen? So my processor has a microphone that you place on the same spot that you would sit in and it auto calibrates by sending signals. This takes reflections into account and makes the initial setup a breeze. Once the calibration is done, I just use my ears to fine tune it. There's not a lot of adjustment required when you are using just 3.1. What the processor can't compensate for is the dynamic range of sound in some situations (difference in sound level between actual program and commercials or extreme action movies where there's stuff happening in every corner and all speakers are being put to the test). Nevertheless, this setup makes watching television and streaming material a hell lot more enjoyable... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted September 1, 2021 Author Share Posted September 1, 2021 9 hours ago, stratocaster said: So my processor has a microphone that you place on the same spot that you would sit in and it auto calibrates by sending signals. This takes reflections into account and makes the initial setup a breeze. Once the calibration is done, I just use my ears to fine tune it. There's not a lot of adjustment required when you are using just 3.1. What the processor can't compensate for is the dynamic range of sound in some situations (difference in sound level between actual program and commercials or extreme action movies where there's stuff happening in every corner and all speakers are being put to the test). Nevertheless, this setup makes watching television and streaming material a hell lot more enjoyable... Yeah mine does the same deal… It is supposed to ship this week of next out of Illinois. So maybe we have similar AVs or they just all do it? I can always play through the two channel amp and listen to music without the TV on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted September 2, 2021 Author Share Posted September 2, 2021 (edited) Well I ordered a couple of Buttkicker LFEs, so they should be to me in a month. I have a Vandy sub that I got from Randy at Optimal in Santa Monica… (Used). That was maybe 15 years ago so it is likely 20+ years old. Maybe the BK-LFEs will suit the TV watching and the 2.1 will be enough? I have REW so I can at least see what is happening. But it will be a few weeks to a month, before I am back in SW house… so that will wait. At least the buttkickers can supply some 5-30Hz without waking the neighbours… and it also gives me chance to use those springy speaker decouplers that people rave about between the sofa and the floor so as to not excite the house with LFE. Then I’ll keep the spikes on the legs of 2Cs. Or… Maybe I could use a handful of intake valve springs between the sofa and the floor. One 16v dual cam head should be enough 🤔 The AV preamp/processor is going to ship out next week, so that will also take a month to work its way to me with the usual Covid and transport logistics delays. But it is still a bit exciting for me. Today I ordered $450 in Neutrik XLRs, interconnect/microphone cable, and a couple of XLR to RCA to get the AVR’s L/R into my existing preamp. So I’ll have some soldering to do. (Luckily the Mogami wire was available in brown, so it should hide well against wood.) A week ago, the Mrs showed me a bunch of secondhand tables to put the TV on… while we were in the car. I said, “I do not want a secondhand table just to use it for a while and then throw it out… and… There is a place a km or two up the road that had 20 tables that are exactly perfect”. She asked, “where is it?” And I pointed to the left. She said, “that’s a saw mill!” I said, “Yeah those sneaky bastards have hidden the tables inside of the Jarrah wood… And the local Men’s Shed has the saws and sanders needed to get them free… 😉“ If Australia had a larger Vandy presence, then maybe @Richard Vandersteen could use some Jarrah veneer for the local customers? I do not even know if there are any Audio or HT shows in Australia… so it is not likely to be seen as a plus. In any case the Jarrah looks like a cross between Mahogony and Walnut in colour, and a tighter grain structure than mahogany but not as tight as maple… so more like Oak or Walnut in grain. I have been looking at the Nexus lifts as a way to hid the TV… so it will be a bit of chin scratching, and if the hearth is where she wants it in the long term, then a table is a non starter for TV, and I’ll just will put equipment in it with a different layout… maybe in the corner of the room (where the TV was sitting.) Jarrah is the wood that is on the floor. Edited September 2, 2021 by Holmz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted October 14, 2021 Author Share Posted October 14, 2021 My multi k$ “used AVR”, has been on a pallet in Sydney for ~20 days, and might be here next week… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctsooner Posted October 15, 2021 Share Posted October 15, 2021 Wow. Good luck. Hope you get it soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted November 4, 2021 Author Share Posted November 4, 2021 (edited) A timely post on. ASR…https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/vandersteen-vcc-5-review-center-speaker.27776/ I am still awaiting the speakers to arrive., and the shipping for the AVP alone was 2-3 months. It all happens slowly with Covid these days. Edited November 4, 2021 by Holmz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GdnrBob Posted November 4, 2021 Share Posted November 4, 2021 19 hours ago, Holmz said: A timely post on. ASR…https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/vandersteen-vcc-5-review-center-speaker.27776/ Just read through that thread. Mr. V's ears must be burning.😲 B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted November 4, 2021 Author Share Posted November 4, 2021 I would suspect that a 2C (etc.) would measure better. And at least with the 2 series there are some sound basics and evolution happening. However the Spinorama stuff is pretty new,. I think that the 2C# speakers have a dipole nature to them, but in HT it is hard to have all the heads in the same vice. I am not sure what to make of the review, other than using some EQ, and maybe tilting a center channel up. Maybe the AVP does all the EQ I need? Or maybe I need to do something else. The upside down impulse response did not look right to my eye… like the speaker was wired 180 out in phase. I do that myself, but my preamp is inverting… so I am supposed to be doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GdnrBob Posted November 5, 2021 Share Posted November 5, 2021 22 hours ago, Holmz said: However the Spinorama stuff is pretty new Funny, I was going to say the same thing. The reviewer seems to have done a thorough job, I wonder if some of the measurements had errors in them. B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted March 8, 2022 Author Share Posted March 8, 2022 Collected the VCC5 yesterday from my friend that collected it form DHL. And I have 2 pairs of VSMs, the all are black topped. Unfortunately the box of cables and connectors from Markertech has not arrived yet. I need to source some amps for the VSM surrounds and the VCC5 center channel. Likely nothing too fancy. I might start with the old NAD laying around. But I am also looking at the Class-D gear. I do have one single VTL monoblock which is still working… 😉 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted September 8, 2022 Author Share Posted September 8, 2022 I started on making some VSM end caps today. Basically out of solid Jarrah to match the rest of the wood in the house. If anyone one needs the black end caps, then sing out, or I’ll through them in a box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted September 12, 2022 Author Share Posted September 12, 2022 Got 2x tops and 2x bottoms done. They are intended to match the doors and floors, but every board can be a different hue, and whether the door is oilseed or varnished changes the appearance a bit. Has anyone used or made the pressure bass trap, with the weighted membrane? I am leaning towards trying to measure room modes, and the ceiling is 11’ high. If I can put the mic near up at ~7-1/2 feet up, then I could lay the bass trap on the floor and working whether I am hitting the target modes to dampen… The plan would be the membrane and a VSM on the ceiling for the ATMOS x.x.2 channels. So I would be pulling the end caps off VSMs 3 and 4 and inserting them into a larger frame, sort of like a tack tack toe shape, inside of a frame. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GdnrBob Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 I hope that damaged black cap wasn't the one I shipped to you.😵 17 hours ago, Holmz said: So I would be pulling the end caps off VSMs 3 and 4 and inserting them into a larger frame, sort of like a tack tack toe shape, inside of a frame. I am having a hard time picturing this. Can you make a diagram or something? And, the new end caps look very 'fessional. Bob 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted September 13, 2022 Author Share Posted September 13, 2022 6 hours ago, GdnrBob said: I hope that damaged black cap wasn't the one I shipped to you.😵 I got another set, so these may be those. 😙 6 hours ago, GdnrBob said: I am having a hard time picturing this. Can you make a diagram or something? Pretty rough, but imagine them about 6-7” deep, and the VSM is 5” deep, Then mounted on the ceiling, ideally after getting the resonators tuned to the measured modes. And I probably would want to use tube traps in the corners. 6 hours ago, GdnrBob said: And, the new end caps look very 'fessional. A good craftsman does not blame the tools. And since I spent a bit on the tools, it removes may ability to use some of the usual excuses. 🥸 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmz Posted September 14, 2022 Author Share Posted September 14, 2022 Not much audio related today, but I thought @GdnrBob would like the local botanicals at Kings Park in Perth. And I no picked up some LPs this morning at a place that does coffees and vinyl…. (Vinyl Cafe) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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